Moose McClintock, from Dimension-Polyant Sailcloth answers some questions about, well, sailcloth. Enjoy. At left is one of their new Code Zero Laminates.



SA: Explain for our readers what the latest with the string patent is and how that affects what you guys do.

MM: Most of the patent issues have gone by the boards, there is only one left, I think, that is still 100% Sobstad and it doesn't affect how we do our membranes. The North patent on continuous yarns still applies though that isn't an issue since D4 and most other membrane products are seamed so the yarns are discontinuous.

SA: What is the status of the new D4 material - give us the pros and cons of D4 as a fabric.

MM: D4 has gone through several iterations since we became involved in 2004. We've introduced Technora as a standard yarn (to go along with Aramid, Vectran and Carbon) for a more durable product and have done a lot of work on the films. We produce the films in our plant in Putnam, CT so we have a lot of control over the quality of the end product as far as weights and glue levels, this was a bit of an issue when D4 used to buy films from various suppliers and had problems with consistency, particularly glue content. We have increased UV durability and increased our ability to do colored films though there is a premium on that. We've also added a production plant in our main office in Germany to help deal with the European market, this has opened up production more and more from our Australian plant (where D4 was originated by Bob Fraser). Both plants just had upgrades to the yarn laying and lamination floors to increase the quality of the product, it's pretty amazing to see how small imperfections from an uneven base in the lamination process can totally affect the quality of the lamination.

As for the pros and cons of this style of construction (and the comparable processes of UK/Halsey, Ullman, Quantum et al), you'd have to look at it as a comparison to the benchmark of 3DL. Most of the processes in use right now involve laying load bearing yarns on flat films, laminating the yarns between another layer of film and then shaping the flat sections with horizontal broadseaming. 3DL lays load bearing yarns on a shaped film in one continuous path so there are no seams. The disadvantage to the seamed process, obviously, is having seams. Although the seams are actually stronger than the rest of the sail, it introduces another step in production and adds a very slight amount of weight to the sail. However, there is an upside to this as well. Since the seams are stronger than the sail, the lamination has to be of a much higher level to prevent the yarns within the seam from separating from the films. This higher level of lamination is developed though much higher pressure which translates to needing less glue overall with a lower chance of delamination. In the long run, the weights of D4 are comparable to similar DPI sails from any other supplier and are often lighter. In the 3DL process, lamination quality is not as important since the yarns will always take up the load, this is one large advantage to that mode of construction.

Another plus to this style construction is the ability to introduce multiple yarns within sections of the sail and also to increase DPI in areas of higher load if that is needed. We can also terminate reef yarns at seams if needed to prevent multiple yarn layering throughout the sail where it isn't needed, keeping the sail lighter with the same directional load strength.

SA: When DP looks at the world of 3DL, Fusion, Ultra, Genesis, et all, what does it see?

MM: We see the future of sailcloth, which is the reason we involved ourselves with the D4 process. Bob Fraser noted when he went to the Admirals Cup in 1995 that there was only one boat there without a membrane sail: his. With that in mind he went about creating a membrane product that he could initially sell in Australia but eventually sell worldwide. I'm sure that all the other sailmaking groups saw the same thing. I think the biggest problem is that we didn't get involved soon enough and many of our customers were forced, through the success of the membrane products that were on the market, to investigate and begin to work the process themselves, and I'm fairly sure that most of them would prefer not to have to be in that part of the business, it's a huge expense with a lot of peripheral issues to deal with. As the largest supplier of laminated sailcloth worldwide, D/P recognized that membranes were the direction cloth was going and wanted to have the ability to provide a membrane process to all sailmakers so that no one would be at a competitive disadvantage. Many of the groups that have developed their own membrane process still buy membranes from us, particularly in larger applications, and this shows good confidence in the D4 product, both from our experience in lamination and standing behind the product.

SA: Spinnakers are clearly going very asymmetrical for many people, what are your material developments there? Are people tending to pick one all purpose weight, if so what is it?

MM: A-sails are certainly becoming more common with many of the newer designs, and many retrofits, targeting this configuration for performance. For the most part, Nylon covers the gamut for the average sailor and there really isn't any need for anything more. As you get up into the higher level applications, where the boats are huge and water ballast or swing keel applications increase the loads dramatically, laminates with high modulus fiber reinforcement (and in many cases membranes) are needed to deal with the dynamic forces being created. We have a line of Code 0 fabrics specifically targeted for, well, Code 0's, but these styles also go into A-sails on larger boats. We've also done one-off styles for Volvo 70's and larger A-sails where different flying and durability characteristics are required.

However, nylon will still be the main product for most applications. One thing that I've noticed personally is the change in the overall nylon inventory on most boats, it wasn't that long ago when every boat had a 1.5 oz. kite for heavy air, even down to 35 footers. With the trend in sailing going away from distance sailing and courses becoming more windward leeward, there is less need for heavier, durable styles when the courses dictate a lighter material. The other determining factor is what kind of sailing most people are doing.....whereas weekend racing used to be the big draw, time pressures have relegated weekends to getting kids to soccer or little league so weeknight sailing has really taken off. The disadvantage of that, of course, is that there is generally less breeze at night (unless you live in an extremely windy area) so the nylon again gets targeted down to a lighter material. Overall, a .6 oz. 30/20 is probably the best all around nylon for the majority of sailing being done, it's heavy enough to go into the 20's in most cases (thinking that most boats in the US are 40' and under) yet durable enough to deal with beer drinking crews who might shred a .5 oz. kite on a weeknight.

SA: Let's pick a boat - the new Flying Tiger 10M (big surprise, eh?). Spec out an AP inventory and why.

MM: Lots of options on this depending on how serious you want to get. Having followed the development of this class from the get-go, I can see the overwhelming value for the boat is its' bottom line price. With that in mind (and as debated on the forums) the class has sails that come with the boat and those will be fine for a lot of the sailing that the boat will be used for. I noticed that the sails you have on your boat are our Flex Aramid line and this fits into the spirit of the boat for a couple reasons. Flex is a crosscut fabric with an array of yarns addressing off angle loading. Crosscut materials are becoming a favorite with sailmakers because they are quick and easy to build with a minimum of waste, making it a less expensive product. Is a crosscut sail going to be as good as a tri-radial? Probably not in direct load or in weight but with the overall angle coverage, as well as more film coverage by the yarns, it will be a rugged, long life product that should tend to shrink less.

If you wanted to step up a bit into Carbon, tri-radials out of our GPL product would be incredibly strong and lighter, but also more expensive. We should have our crosscut Flex carbon styles within the next month or so (originally we expected to have the line done in November but, just like trying to build membrane products, it's not as easy as it looks sometimes) and they would also be an excellent choice though I'm not sure that a boat as light and easily driven as the Tiger really needs the ultimate strength of carbon. So the best option, for the time being (read: until you guys have more time and figure out if you need something as strong as carbon) is an Aramid in either crosscut for durability and cost or in tri-radial configuration for lightest and strongest.

The kite is pretty easy, as I said above a .6 will cover the majority of the applications. I really don't see this boat ever needing anything heavier, in lighter areas such a San Diego you might want a .5 oz. specialty kite for VMG conditions and light running. The .5 could actually go pretty high in wind range but, as an A-sail, it would come down to the crew and your confidence in whether they could manage the sail without damaging it as to whether this would be an AP sail.

SA: The advent of serious big boat offshore racing is here in a very big way. How do you guys tackle making product for that arena and what are the unique challenges?

MM: The first thing we did was introduce our GPL carbon line as the first viable carbon product on the market. Although it took a couple years to gain full acceptance, it's amazing how quickly our premium Kevlar line disappeared (basically less than a year) once Carbon sails were recognized as being much stronger and surprisingly durable. This durability comes through inserting the Carbon yarns rather than introducing them into the laminate as a coated yarn, this allows it much higher flexibility and in conjunction with the Technora base scrim that carries the Carbon, GPL's actually outlive Aramid in most cases. However, despite the outstanding performance of the product it is still a paneled product and the perception of a lighter, stronger product in membranes meant moving in that direction as well (personally, I don't think you see the full value of a membrane sail until you get over 40' but that's just me). With D4 we were able to continue to supply a viable product for sailmakers who didn't have the financial access to membrane production. I think I've explained the reasoning for al this above but as I stressed before, sticking a couple pieces of film around some fiber and getting it to stay in one piece is not as easy as it looks. Production techniques vary widely depending on size, DPI and yarn type. There are many individual requirements based on specific customer preferences. Every membrane is a custom product (in case the readership wonders why they're so expensive) and there is a lot of time spent in individual yarn layouts and interpreting the production phases based on the components. To produce a consistent product through this isn't easy.

And of course, the biggest challenge is how to compete in a market which is dominated by a single sailmaker, especially one with a lot of momentum and a very good product. The answer is to continue to develop the product, make it more consistent, durable and available.

SA: Let's talk about your market - what makes up the largest percentage of your business? Are there emerging markets? And where would you guys like to have a lager presence where you currently do not?

MM: Woven polyester is by far the biggest part of the business. Keep in mind, no matter what, when you look out at boats on the water there are always far, far more white sails than anything else. One nice thing about D/P is we are the only cloth supplier with our own looms, we have the capacity to weave around 250,000 yards monthly. Wovens are and always will be the biggest part of the sailcloth market.

As far as emerging markets, there really aren't that many in sailcloth. We do have an industrial division that is constantly looking for other applications, whether in woven or laminated goods, that is growing (about 25% last year). Having the ability to produce laminated goods in house for other markets (drum heads, sandpaper, blimps, etc.) is a good way to keep product running out the door.

One area of growth that we have been working on for the last couple years is performance nylon. This is a tough market to get into right now because the other three sailcloth suppliers all have good products and it's important not to introduce a product to simply fill out the product line. Our all-purpose nylons have always sold well but the performance end requires a lot of development as far as finishes, weights and durability (tears). We go through a different coating and finishing process than the other suppliers, doing all this in house rather than subbing it out sets us apart a bit but it takes a while to get the momentum up to critical mass. Results of our Formulon line have been very good to date, we just have to keep working to increase volume.

SA: Are you doing anything in the AC?

MM: We are involved with the China syndicate for their fore and aft sails right now in D4. This has been an interesting project for us in that we have a lot of input, though not final decision, on many of the construction parameters of the sails. We are able to import their yarn layouts and shapes so they're getting what they require. We spoke with a couple other groups but for the most part they are all using the same sailmaker and there is a certain amount of pressure for them to stay with the status quo. They also have a certain amount of history due to having been getting sails for this go round from that sailmaker so I would expect that in the next event we would see more interest from other groups as the D4 option would be available to them from the beginning of the Cup cycle rather than halfway through.

SA: OD and Dacron is obviously still very much alive. Has Dacron gone about as far as it can go?

MM: I would think that Dacron (woven polyester) has pretty much reached it's limit as far as development. One affecting factor is that Dupont discontinued many of the very good high performing yarns since the market was so small. Most of the suppliers are using European yarn now which has the same chemical characteristics as the Dupont yarns so there is no drop off in performance but there doesn't seem to be any breakthrough performance polyester yarn coming down the road that will affect the market. The biggest changes we see are in the weaving and finishing end of things. Advances in calandaring and coatings has improved the overall quality of woven polyester from all suppliers, minimizing 2nds and improving the overall performance of wovens. We have also been able to weave supporting substrates within the polyester in high modulus yarns like Spectra/Dyneema, up to 48,000 DPI, which gives the sailor a woven fabric far beyond your fathers Dacron sail. What you will see are changes in construction for specific applications as well as more hybrid constructions (such as the Hood Vectron which is a polyester/Vectran blend, as well as the polyester/Spectra-Dyneema blends that we and a couple other suppliers do) for high end cruising applications. There have been some polyester/Pentex hybrids that show some promise in one design applications but it's difficult to see if there is a real performance jump in relation to durability and cost.

SA: SA is interested in the performance cruising market - what do you offer that market that is better in terms of better performing material?

MM: This is actually one of the bigger growing markets in sailmaking. There seems to be an explosion of more top end cruising boats than I can remember and there are a couple different ways of dealing with them. Dacron, as I said before, will always be there and is always going to be a good, durable and economic choice on any size boat (the sails on Maltese Falcon are woven polyester). Another direction is the Dacron blends, which I described above. These styles show a lot of interest because they shouldn't mildew compared to laminates and you can get good durability out of them though they won't have quite as good shape holding as high modulus styles. For the more high performance cruisers, Carbon is beginning to become a way of life as an excellent shape holding product that is being viewed as more durable than previously thought due to changes in it's processing in construction. We offer several carbon blends (with Spectra/Dyneema, Vectran or Technora) depending on price constraints and application that cover boats from 35' to 180'. With the increasing complexity of sail handling systems we've also seen a huge influx of D4 in this market as weight and bulkiness (particularly for in-mast and in-boom furlers) require integrated patching to cut down on the thickness of the sails. There are also a few new yarns out there that we are working on, I can't speculate on the timing for them to see the market but the idea is to make sure we don't overprice the fabric to the market, most of the newer exotic fibers are pretty expensive.

SA: We are always interested in what might be coming next - what are some of the new sail cloth developments that we might see?

MM: There are a couple different ways of processing yarns and films that should decrease lead times and increase lamination quality, many are in production with various suppliers and that is always helpful to the sailmaker. There are other processes involving extruded high modulus films and integrated fibers within films that are still a bit down the road, as well as some fibers that might be good fits for the market but might be too expensive to use. We've actually seen a lot of new developments in the last 5 years or so in Carbon and it might be a little ways down the road before we see anything that's earth shaking. I would count on more small improvements with the products we have for the near future and look for more membrane products. Down the road the membranes should be fine tuned enough to be available throughout the market and with improvements in lamination and films should be as durable as woven cloth is now.

SA: Thanks Moose!

MM: No problem.

01/30/07