|
Tom
Whidden is as synonymous with our sport here in this country as anybody.
Former President and now CEO of the North Marine Group, Tom is one of
the more respected and truly established figures in sailmaking. He is
perhaps equally known as one of Dennis Conner's long-standing and most
trusted members of TDC's various America's Cup efforts. Tom's presence
in both arenas has gone a long way towards establishing a professional
air to both, and in particular has often been the calm foil to DC's antics.
We (and a lot of you readers) had questions for him, and Tom dutifully,
if a bit guardedly, fielded them all. - The Ed
The
lawsuit victory, if you will, versus Peter Conrad and Sobstad, was a pivotal
moment for the future of 3DL and North. In approximate dollars, how expensive
was that protracted legal battle?
TW:
In
reality, this was not a victory for North Sails. Sobstad and North chose
to settle this protracted litigation simply because it was a poor use
of both companies time and resources. Certainly both of us are glad to
have it behind us, and as you suggest, it was important for 3DL's future,
particularly with many AC syndicates counting on us heavily for sails
for the 2003 Cup.
There
was a point when it seemed that North would lose the suit. How worried
were you? And what would the plan had been if you had lost?
TW:
In
fact, we did lose the first round. We liked our chances in appeal, but
one never knows, and it was indeed cause for concern. We did have a number
of contingency plans including a new plant in a country where there was
no patent coverage. However, the settlement made things much easier.
While
we understand that there is some sort of non-disclosure agreement, can
you tell us, again in approximate dollars, what was the cost to settle
with Conrad? The rumor is that it was around $5 million dollars.
TW:
Sorry,
but we did have a non-disclosure agreement, which both sides have honored
religiously. I will say, like any lawsuit settlement, we paid more than
we would like and I'm sure Peter would say he accepted less than he would
like.
I
wonder how many people realize that you were, along with Conrad, the driving
force behind Sobstad's ascension to the top of the sailmaking mountain.
There was a time when Sobstad was very near, with outstanding grand Prix
sails, and an AC victory with Dennis in '87, becoming the king of sailmaking.
And then it all went very wrong. And though it was long ago, it was a
pivotal decision for the future of north and Sobstad. Can you tell us
what exactly happened between you and Conrad?
3DL Sandwich |
TW:
Yes,
I would like to believe that Peter Conrad and I did a great job with Sobstad
in those years you refer to. I think what happened was that Peter and
I had different vision on where we wanted the company to go. So the fact
that we went separate ways probably enabled both of us to achieve our
different objectives.
North
would appear to be as dominant, if not more so, than ever, yet there are
challenges to overcome. What, in your estimation, are the biggest obstacles
facing North, now and the future?
TW:
I
am honored by your compliment regarding North's dominance. However, looking
from the inside, I never allow myself the luxury to consider our relatively
strong market position as a huge benefit. In fact, one of our biggest
challenges is to appreciate what has allowed us to be relatively successful,
which is our never-ending commitment to our team, our product and our
relationship with the sailing community. Perhaps one of our biggest obstacles
is to fight the "Big Blue" image. While we are a large company
in the sailmaking arena, we try very hard to treat every customer as if
we were a smaller company.
There
has always been an undercurrent of dissatisfaction with North service,
especially for "the little guy". How do you plan to improve
in this area?
TW:
I
think that we get a little bit of a bad rap here. The truth is, we have
more account representatives, repair and service representatives, and
worldwide locations per sailor capita than any other company. In virtually
every meeting and every communication inside the company, we talk about
making North Sails more approachable for any type of sailor. I would bet
that our relatively large size inhibits many potential clients from giving
us a try just in fear that we wouldn't be as responsive as they would
like. However, I would like to think that these potential clients would
be pleasantly surprised if they did indeed give us a shot.
A
number of our readers had questions for you. Here are a few:
The
new roto 3DL seems interesting, if nothing than from a potential price-point
perspective. How much less expensive will they be than "conventional"
3DL sails, and what are the target markets/classes for the new roto 3DL's?
RM Series |
TW:
We
are very excited about our new RM (Rotary Molded) sails for a number of
reasons. The most exciting potential for our RM system is to build better
3DL sails for boats under 35 feet in length. We have been handcuffed at
3DL in its present form to be cost-effective for smaller sails. Not only
does RM allow us to build sails less expensively than before, but we can
now build them more accurately with all of the strength and lightness
that 3DL sails are known for. In many cases, RM sails will sell for half
the price of comparably built 3DL sails. There is no limitation for target
markets or classes for RM. Of course, some classes prohibit laminated
sails, like the J/24 class. Ironically, we have sold a number of J/24
RM sails to sailors who race their boats in non-class events.
Can
North Sails quantify (in seconds/mile, or perhaps pointing in degrees)
the performance difference between their sails and the competition for
a few classes? How do we (and North Sails) know that the sails are faster
and not just that the boats are sailed by most of the best sailors in
the biz and would win regardless of the sails used?
TW:
Wow,
you're really putting me on the spot. Honestly, we work non-stop to get
any edge in any area in any class or handicap environment that we can.
We take great pride in making a well-designed, highly engineered and perfectly
manufactured product that performs to a sailor's performance expectations.
I suppose that we are fortunate that more sailors do indeed use North
sails, and therefore, we have a better chance to win races. Also, I would
like to think that the best sailors often choose North because we make
the best product. But in reality, we still need to come up with the best
ideas day-in and day-out and convince sailors with our technology that
they should try our sails.
Does
the new Doyle D4 product infringe on North's or anyone else's intellectual
property, and will North be a party against Doyle in any action re D4?
TW:
We
believe firmly that Doyle's D4 product infringes Peter Conrad's '080 Genesis
patent. We are actually a licensee of this particular technology and will
certainly assert our rights as a licensee.
Any
reaction to the incendiary rhetoric coming from Quantum?
TW:
No,
I actually have quite a bit of respect for the Quantum company. I believe
that they pay as much attention to sailmaking quality and details as any
company in our industry. I know that they have made the comment that we
get most of the America's Cup and Volvo Ocean Race business because we
demand exclusivity. But as you are now aware, this simply isn't the case.
In fact, we actually encourage our highest profile customers to try other
products to help us learn and to make sure that we are continually tested.
Also, it has been suggested that we will only sell a Southern Spars mast
to a North client or vice-versa. This is also incorrect. We do, however,
enjoy an advantage in addressing the "engine above the deck"
as a unitary speed producing issue. Both Southern Spars and North Sails
work closely together in producing the best rig/sail combination in the
business.
North
has been criticized for not being forthright about the panels in 3 DL
sails. A reader asks: The question I want answered is this. when will
big blue finally tell the public the truth about their "Seamless
Sails"?
Conventional vs 3DL |
TW:
The
truth is, that even sailmakers have a hard time understanding exactly
what makes a 3DL sail such a breakthrough. In reality, every yarn that
provides the basis for a 3DL sail's load-carrying capacity, is laid over
a mold in the exact shape that the sail will ultimately fly in and then
film is utilized to lock in the fiber pattern and to keep the wind from
passing through, and then shrink formed to produce a unitary, flexible,
molded composite sail membrane. Because rolls of film can only be found
in approximately 60-inch widths, we need to use multiple pieces of Mylar
film to make-up the two skins. However, the butt joints of these films
play no part in the strength or shape of the final sail. Once the sail
is heated and vacuum-bagged, the final composite becomes a single, unitary,
flexible membrane bearing no resemblance to the individual components.
Another
reader asks: I'm familiar with load sensing equipment used in various
applications (rope clutches, stays, shrouds, etc..), if you would, please
ask what sort of sensors they use to detect/determine loads on sails as
well as how they are used.
TW:
We
do, from time to time, use pressure sensitive load cell sensors in various
areas of sails. The 3DL process particularly lends itself to laminating
in small sensors with wires inside the laminate. However, with today's
computer analysis capabilities, most load cases are well predicted by
computer programs that have been developed by North designers.
What
is behind the rumor that North will only get behind AC campaigns that
go with them exclusively?
TW:
The
answer is no. In fact, we encourage syndicates to check-in with other
sailmakers as they see fit to make sure that we/they aren't missing any
trends. We relish the competition and couldn't be the best if we weren't
willing and able to be challenged.
There
always seem to be a group of sailors with an ax to grind against North,
how often do you get directly involved with an unsatisfied customer? Do
you think you are made aware of all of them, or do they get hidden/lost
in the layers that make up N/S
TW:
I
do. I like to know when a customer is dissatisfied. It is a great opportunity
to turn around a bad situation and make a loyal satisfied client from
one who was unhappy. Most likely, I am not aware of them all, but I try
to relate to the majority.
How
do you answer the critics that claim N/S is "too big a company to
care about me" and "I'm better off with a smaller or local sailmaker"?
TW:
In
fact, I believe that we have more locations, more account representatives
and more service and sales representatives than any other sailmaker. It
is correct that we are larger, but we fight the large image by trying
extra-hard to provide good service and good sales representation. I find
our own guys, in general, to be quite approachable and helpful. All we
can keep doing is to keep the positive attitude on this front and keep
trying hard.
I've heard of just hanging around but this is too much |
Do
you think that on occasion, a North product is pushed out to the public
before it's ready and all the problems have been ironed out? 3DL de-laminations
of 5 or 6 years ago come to mind, what sort of testing program do new
products go thru before they get the thumbs up?
TW:
Yes,
I think that we have been guilty of letting products into the marketplace
before they are 100% perfected. 3DL is an example. About seven years ago,
we did have some lamination problems, but we tried to make good on these
issues as best we could. I think that we have become more conservative
on this front and will be less likely to launch products prematurely in
the future.
Cars
get tested before production, electronics get tested, drinking plastic
cups get tested. What kind of test routine does north perform to ensure
longevity of the production run sails prior to producing them?
TW:
The
lesson we learned from the 3DL de-lamination issues is that we needed
to employ a more scientific approach to our testing methods. We now have
a very sophisticated laboratory in our Nevada plant. We have no fewer
than 25 people in the company with engineering degrees. And we have three
engineers whose only responsibility is to test materials and adhesives
before they are put into use.
It
has become clear to me that North's target market is new boats (so they
can get their blue dot in the magazine photos), and the high-volume one-designs
and glamour boats. The occasional orders from PHRF'ers like me are low
priority. Am I wrong, Mr. Whidden?
TW:
I
think most people would be surprised to know what our actual product mix
is. In units, half of our sail products go to cruisers and cruiser-racers.
We like to sell sails to PHRF racers and with our new 3DL RM product line,
we will be able to make the best laminated racing sails for less money
than has ever been possible.
I'm
considering a 3DL-RM heavy #1 for a SC 27. The boat (and sails) is raced
hard and abused. Can I realistically expect a 2-year life from the sail,
or are there "build issues" yet to be resolved, like with the
early 3DLs?
Anyone need a Fast tan! |
TW:
Great!
We would love to make a 3DL RM Heavy for your SC 27. I would only need
to know if the load case for your boat fits the DPI limitation that RM
has presently.
Appraise
the leadership skills of Kenny - strengths/weaknesses.
TW:
I
have found Kenny to be a great leader and well liked by most people that
have sailed with him. Personally, I have enjoyed my sailing time with
him, particularly; the last two AC's and last summer's America's Cup Jubilee
onboard Stealth. He also has provided excellent leadership inside the
ranks at North Sails.
Should
Kenny relinquish his role in the afterguard to a full time professional
sailor (the crew definitely has an opinion on that one)?
TW:
No,
he has worked very hard to be in the position he has been in today and
deserves it.
Does
he think that the character of TDC training (execute tactics until the
team is exhausted, 1 NM legs with peels and sets, etc.) is the best approach?
It certainly seems to be different -old school-from the approach of the
other teams.
TW:
Probably,
you make a good point here. On the other hand, I think in the big picture,
the training program has been about right. We had a very close, tough
first race against the British and the crew responded brilliantly. Because
the sailing program has been led by Kenny, I have to give him credit for
making the crew as cohesive and competent as they are.
Does
he think that Dennis' loyalty to the people he has sailed with for years
leads to a weaker, less innovative crew?
TW:
Actually,
I personally think the opposite. Regarding Kenny's feeling, I haven't
heard that. Dennis is loyal to people that he has sailed with in the past,
but not to a fault. I think he rewards loyalty and competence. Trust me,
he wouldn't have someone in his campaigns that weren't the best he could
find. Maybe the only exception is me.
Excluding
83/87 (too easy), what are his best/worst memories from AC competition?
TW:
If
you mean Dennis, 1980 was very special for Dennis. This was his first
America's Cup campaign that he was totally in charge of. Frankly, he re-defined
the AC sport that year. It was the first time that a full two-boat program
was used and also the first time that the program started two years before
the event.
DC's
strengths/weaknesses?
TW:
Great
leadership, great decision making, great vision (especially big picture).
He has forgotten more about sailing than most of us will know in a lifetime.
Still can win in most any boat. Weaknesses? Not many.
Views
on new AC developments and how they will enter the general market.
TW:
Certainly,
any supplier who puts the time into learning what AC competition can teach
will gain substantially and will be in a position to offer the technology
to the market. For our company, we learn so much about making sails stronger
and lighter and so much about the materials available that it will help
every client in the future. Regarding the mast business, building carbon
masts is certainly the future. We learn a lot about composite technology
on the cutting edge.
And
lastly: Who makes a better Dark and Stormy, Maddies or The Landing?
TW:
Somebody
just told me that Maddies and The Landing are in Marblehead. Unfortunately,
I live in Essex, so I can't comment.
Thanks
Tom!
TW:
Thanks
Scot, for the opportunity to contribute. Tom
|
